New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  grasshopp3r on Mon May 04, 2009 5:44 pm

Personally, what I would like to see is a direct challenge to the poker (and liquor licensing) laws in Colorado. Now that we have a precedent in Greeley that poker is a skill game, we need to have a wave of cases across Colorado.

Would the DPT create a strategy to implement this? Obviously, there is some risk, however, the upside is huge, both for the DPT, bar owners and of course, players.

Can we come up with some other ideas?

grasshopp3r

Posts : 40
Join date : 2008-04-16

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Re: New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  Math Backwards on Tue May 05, 2009 7:51 pm

How exactly would DPT do this? Have a cash buy-in?

I'm sure you could find a bar and hold your own cash tourney. Be sure to advertise and you can be a case subject.

Math Backwards

Posts : 43
Join date : 2008-08-03

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Re: New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  grasshopp3r on Wed May 06, 2009 3:53 pm

I was also thinking of a charity tournament, but a purely cash tourney would work. Since Brian is so familiar with the laws, perhaps he has some unique observations on the issues. I know that there are several different types of liquor licenses, for example. There are also different jurisdictions within the metro area.

I think "poker as a skill game" is a winning argument and should be brought to as many venues as possible.

grasshopp3r

Posts : 40
Join date : 2008-04-16

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Re: New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  SnowOcean on Thu May 07, 2009 1:11 pm

fwiw i played a charity tournament last week. the organizer told me they couldn't legally give prizes away even if they were donated.
SnowOcean
SnowOcean

Posts : 95
Join date : 2008-10-21

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Legal Poker Games?

Post  Denver Poker Tour on Thu May 07, 2009 2:02 pm

Great idea for a topic of conversation!

After dealing with the CBI (Colorado Bureau of Investigation) and the CDG (Colorado Division of Gaming) and CTLE (Colorado liquor & Tobacco Enforcement) over the years, they have all agreed upon one thing.

Gambling = Risk, Chance, Reward.

Translation:
If you take the risk, any amount of money required to participate, the chance, the game of poker ( I know people are in disagreement about poker being a game of skill vs. luck), and the reward, any "prize" awarded based upon performance.... it becomes illegal.

So how does this translate to the way the DPT is currently doing business? We don't require the risk.

So, how can you make a game legal?
Well, for charity events... You can ask for a "donation" to play. You request that all attendees make a "donation". Problem is though, you have to let everyone play whether they make a donation or not. Now you open your door to anyone who doesn't feel like making a "donation" but still wants to play. But, since you have removed the "risk" factor, this is now legal. AND you can still award prizes based upon performance.
The only downside, is that if people don't have to make a donation, they won't. Which means the charity could quite possible not make any money at their event.

Now, in my opinion of what I have been told by the "Alphabet" government agencies, if you also a have a BONA FIED social relationship, examples... everyone works at AT&T, the same law firm, the 7-11, or everyone is a member of an established social club, Elks, Lions, Rotary, this also constitutes a social relationship. But you still can not, take a rake from the game.

But all of these "social relationships" have to be based entirely on the "social relationship" that these players have BESIDES the game of poker. For example, you cannot create a "social relationship" where all you do is play poker.

Private home games... I have been told just keep it friendly, no rake, no "grocery money" dues, no membership fees. Just have you and your close personal friends play. Its' when people make a mockery of these rules, that's when the powers that be get upset. Also, when you invite an undercover cop into your game, cuz he found out about it on Craigs List, you can't claim your game is social because you should have known he was an undercover cop... hence he's probably not your close friend.

By the way, the Law Enforcement officials that investigate these matters only do so, because they have been informed by their powers that be that they have to. The current Governor and Secretary of State, and Attorney General, in my own personal opinion... are not fans of poker in general. Which is specifically why my company and the attorney's run EVERY promotion and activity that we do well before hand, by them to make sure we don't violate any rule.

And for the record, we have been nailed for something we thought was legal, and it turned out not to be.
Case in point, I had three (3) skill stop slot machines in my business. These are the Japanese models you see on late night TV info-mercials. I purchased three (3) of them to use in my casino party operation business. Now even though they only took tokens, they were illegal, and they were seized by the CBI and destroyed. Lesson learned, and it cost me ALOT of money.

I hope my comments helped you out in someway, and I look forward to seeing more comments about this in the future.

Brian Masters
Denver Poker Tour

Denver Poker Tour

Posts : 29
Join date : 2008-10-20

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Re: New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  grasshopp3r on Fri May 08, 2009 4:22 pm

There are two main exemptions to the gambling laws; the social relationship exemption and the skill game exemption. I believe that the skill game exemption is the route to legalized poker in Colorado. We just need more jurisdictions and precedents.

The liquor laws also relate to the gambling laws as it is a liquor law violation to have any gambling on the premises. Not many places that have their liquor license want to jepordize it with a poker test. We need some place that does not have that risk, which should not be hard to find.

grasshopp3r

Posts : 40
Join date : 2008-04-16

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Re: New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  Math Backwards on Sat May 09, 2009 10:57 am

So pass out flyers at Aurora city hall inviting people to your home game....

Math Backwards

Posts : 43
Join date : 2008-08-03

Back to top Go down

New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws Empty Re: New Challenges to the Colorado Poker Laws

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum